Interview: Did Abolitionist Hatred of the South Cause the Civil War?

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Here’s an interview with Thomas Fleming on his new book, Disease in the Public Mind: A New Understanding of Why We Fought the Civil War:

FLEMING: Americans first experienced one of these episodes in 1692, when the leaders of the Massachusetts Bay Colony became convinced that witches were threatening their society with evil powers. Over two hundred people were arrested and flung into fetid jails. Twenty one were hanged. One 71 year old man was “pressed to death” beneath heavy stones.

No one has described this frenzy better than the great New England novelist, Nathanael Hawthorne. “That terrible delusion…should teach us, among its other morals, that the influential classes… are fully liable to all the passionate error that has ever characterized the maddest mob. Clergymen, judges, statesmen – the wisest, calmest, holiest persons of their day, stood in the inner circle roundabout the gallows, loudest to acclaim the work of blood, latest to confess themselves miserably deceived.” …

FORSMARK: Some of the Abolitionists openly expressed contempt for the blacks their crusade was supposed to be designed to help. Was slavery really the whole story in the full out hatred of the South, or was something else at work in a particular corner of the Yankee mind?

FLEMING: Here we get into the peculiarities of the New England mind. They had a natural tendency to look down on the rest of the country. They saw themselves as the real founders, and were infuriated that the leadership had passed to Jefferson and other southern president. Jefferson’s embargo, which was an economic disaster for New England, was the trigger that made them see the South as enemies. Then they focused on the South’s moral flaw — the continuance — and the growth — of slavery, and the two arguments fused into Abolitionism, a creed proclaimed in their souls by God.

In Britain, one of the ways the situation was diffused was to compensate the slaveholders. Reasonable voices—Abraham Lincoln for example—proposed that here, but the Abolitionists in Congress never backed his bill. The abolitionists’ goal was not persuasion of southerners. It was to shame them into submission, confess their guilt and free the slaves. It was essentially a fanatical religious crusade.

So little has changed.

About Hunter Wallace 9627 Articles
Founder and Editor-in-Chief of Occidental Dissent

25 Comments

  1. I already ordered this book before you posted this article. Dang Hunter, it sounds like you whispered into Fleming’s ear while he was writing this book!

  2. And yada yada yada – a yenta pushes the Tribal agenda.

    I don’t buy Richwine’s idea that Jews are at the top of the IQ pyramid. They wrote the tests and all the curriculum in the gummint skool is kosher. Surprise. Surprise the Jews have the high IQs.

  3. That endless caustic, castigating tone always makes me wonder what their parents were like. Could you imagine living with such people?

    But the soft-spoken can be even worse. That type that walks up and down the road with the leashed dogs, judging all the lawns they pass, knowing all will be helped by their morality and judgements. Sniffing righteously, with the chin in the air, shoulders back, so glad to be a northeasterner, chosen to judge due to being told they have the only true path to GOD, Himself.

    They can make one realize why “the left” sometimes actually becomes necessary AS MUCH AS I HATE TO SAY IT. The left, in the sense of “liberal education” that at least points out (to people like Rachel Maddow) that others exist, and she isn’t really the center of the universe.

  4. My relatives are of this school of thought, though they would deny the witch hunt like any good woman and a woman’s selective memory. Truth be told people like them can build a good town, orderly, dissent suppressed and if few enough coloreds, socially engineer them into near humans (though the Yankees never allow them full moral agency). And they talk to god as equals of course.

  5. The New England Transcendentalists’ hatred for the South caused John Brown’s raid, but the wild schemes of the KGC caused the civil war.

    Emerson, Thoreau, Phillips and Garrison have blood on their hands, but Walker, Yancey and Ruffin have even more blood on their hands.

    All my sympathies are with the vast majority of White Americans caught in the middle, who weren’t part of either extremist group: the moderate Republicans, the Northern Democrats, the Southern Unionists and the reluctant Confederates. All honor to their pugnacious spokesman, Andrew Johnson, the original Pat-Buchanan-look-alike! (And might I add, Knoxville still produces America’s best politicians, such as Chronicles Magazine contributor Congressman John Duncan, the only man with a Numbers USA career A+ who also voted against the Iraq War. Whoever is to blame for Immigration/Imperialism/Insolvancy, it ain’t east Tennessee!)

    I have the utmost respect for Fleming. He was correctly pointing out that Christian conservatives should consider Darwinian hard science an invaluable ally against Freudian and Boasian pseudo-science decades before Kevin MacDonald published Culture of Critique. Sometimes, however, he allows his anti-Protestant and anti-Northern prejudices to cloud his thinking. It will be important to keep this in mind when reading his new book.

    P.S. – My disdain fo the fire eaters and filibusterers of the 1850s most certainly does not extend to the League of the South. Heimbach & co. have my full respect.

  6. Notice how Maddow goes on about “racism”, like it is Heresy.

    She loves non-Whites from her all White enclave, and because she loves non-Whites, everyone outside her enclave must love non-Whites and integrate with non-Whites, or ELSE, Its Witch Burning time!!!

    These people are psychotic.

  7. I went to Wikipedia to check out Maddow’s ethnic background (1/4 Jew, 1/2 Newfoundland Catholic and exactly 0% old-stock New England Yankee), and I found this great quote:

    “I’m undoubtedly a liberal, which means that I’m in almost total agreement with the Eisenhower-era Republican party platform.”

    Presumably, this means she would like to reenact Operation Wetback and reimplement the Walter-McCarren Act. That is perfect immigration policy! We can call it “The Maddow Plan”.

  8. “The New England Transcendentalists (…) Emerson, Thoreau, Phillips and Garrison have blood on their hands” but “Walker, Yancey and Ruffin have even more blood on their hands” and “the wild schemes of the KGC caused the civil war”.

    “All my sympathies are with the vast majority of White Americans caught in the middle, who weren’t part of either extremist group: the moderate Republicans, the Northern Democrats, the Southern Unionists and the reluctant Confederates. All honor to their pugnacious spokesman, Andrew Johnson” and “My disdain for the fire eaters and filibusterers of the 1850s….”

    I think you have the correct view, Whites Unite. I like your comments.

    It is good to know that your Tennessee representative John Duncan is conservative enough to have voted against the globalist invasion of Iraq, as well as the invasion of our own land! http://www.antiwar.com/orig/duncan.php?articleid=9165

  9. Steve Sailer’s commentators also focus on the point that the ethnic composition of the Northeast has changed.

    That’s not in dispute. From the South’s perspective though, there is no difference between Charles Sumner and Ted Kennedy. It is the exact same malevolent spirit and attitude that has always been a menace to us.

  10. “It is the exact same malevolent spirit and attitude that has always been a menace to us.”

    A pyschologising Talmudist would say that is Paranoia. I say it is MISTAKEN to believe northern whites (“Yankees”) hate southerners and are The Enemy.

  11. Playing to the pride of the southern audience with denigrations and demonisation of whites north of the Line, to foment war and secession, was one of the policies of The Knights of the Golden Circle.

  12. The Yankees he speaks of really are that nauseating. They’re pharisees and their disease is ideological.

  13. Jon Brown was financed by a cabal of wealthy Northern industrialists i.e. railroad tycoons, none of whom were prosecuted for financing Brown’s raid on Harpers Ferry.

  14. Rachel MadCow (for she is one) is subtly using a meme that must be turned back on them- in Czarist Russia, where the JEWS were relegated, was known as being ‘Beyond the Pale of Settlement.’ Mad Cow IS a Jew, and Lesbian, so she is ALREADY beyond the Pale of Christendom. As she can never be a citizen of God’s Kingdom on Earth, she is insulting us, by using our own memes against us. Ted Weiland noted correctly in his latest post- only be returning to a corporate, white, biblically-oriented law order, that both demands public stoning, and holds citizenry accountable for carrying out the sentence, will we redeem our land from such whores and sluts, and satanic seed.

    Theonomy or Death.

  15. I thought the abolitionists wanted southern independence to succeed so that they could be rid of the evil south and only fanatical unionists in the north like Lincoln wanted war.

  16. Hunter – I am glad some of Sailer’s commenters made the necessary point that the ‘Yankee’ of today in the Northeast is not kin to the original Yankee (English) colonists.
    It can’t be said often enough apparently, because people do insist on confusing today’s ‘Heinz 57’ New England dwellers with the East Anglian Puritan stock of long ago. Most of the latter’s descendants are now in Utah or the Far West these days, not anywhere near Boston .

    And the Ellis Islanders who first ”ethnically cleansed” the Northeast were/are very much of the aggrieved mindset, and even now identify too often with nonwhites. It is the immigrant experience that shapes how they think and vote, and not the Puritan mindset. The Ellis Islanders are now living side by side with the assorted Third World immigrants of all varieties in Boston, New Haven, etc. Precious few real Yankees there.

  17. [” Here we get into the peculiarities of the New England mind. They had a natural tendency to look down on the rest of the country. “]

    As someone who has read a good deal of Thomas Fleming’s novels, I am very familiar with his dislike of New Englanders. Which is one of the reasons why I cannot take this interview seriously.

  18. I REFUSE to believe that the abolitionists – especially those from New England – are solely to blame for the Civil War. I find this belief childish, blind and incredibly bigoted. By the way, I’m not from New England. Nor do I have any ancestors from New England.

  19. So the Yankees as a people of influence are all but gone, but their evil ideology remains. So it sure did a good job getting rid of them permanently. As we keep pointing out, White people get nothing out of “anti-racism” other than their own genocide.

  20. VA- How right you are. I would never consider the Siciliani of New Yawk to be anywhere near the pure race of the Anglo-Puritans of the Early Colonization of New Amsterdam.

  21. Precious few real Yankees there.

    The Yankees are much like the Jews. They can assimilate all sorts of newcomers and still maintain the basics of their identity, their culture, and their mindset. That is what has happened in New England.

  22. “the pure race of the Anglo-Puritans of the Early Colonization of New Amsterdam.”

    Uhhh… just for the record that would mainly be Dutchmen of the Reformed Church.

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