Northwest Homeland

Posted on March 8, 2010 by Hunter Wallace in White Nationalism // 48 Comments

I was informed this evening that Occidental Dissent had been mentioned on Harold Covington’s Northwest Front. Some friends of mine have read the Northwest Quartet, listen to Radio Free Northwest, and keep tabs on Covington’s work. The discussion about Covington that went on here occurred while I was in Washington for the Amren conference. I was on the road at the time and didn’t get the chance to post my own thoughts.

Basically, I am skeptical of the idea of a Northwest Homeland, but not opposed to the movement. If White Nationalists want to relocate to the Pacific Northwest, I wish them the best of luck. A comrade of mine is a frequent traveler in the region. He is very impressed with Wyoming and Idaho. I think he plans to relocate there eventually. The Northwest has some of the best scenery in America: Crater Lake, Yellowstone, Glacier National Park. If we could establish a base in the region, it would undoubtedly be a huge victory for us.

Therein lies the problem: the Northwest’s great advantage (its relative whiteness) is also its greatest disadvantage. Non-Whites are less numerous in the region. As a consequence, Whites in the area have less daily exposure to the horrors of diversity and are less racially conscious than their counterparts elsewhere. It is easy for Whites to ignore America’s racial decline and live a quiet life in Northwest suburbia. There is no material incentive to take the risk of joining a revolutionary organization like the Northwest Volunteer Army.

The people who “get it” in the Northwest – who are explicitly racial – are often migrants from other parts of the Union. Covington himself is from North Carolina. According to Leonard Zeskind, there are about 30,000 hardcore White Nationalists in America. If every single one of these people moved to the Northwest tomorrow, an extremely unlikely scenario, and united behind a single dynamic leader and common political platform, an even more unlikely scenario, they would be roughly the size of a small town. White Nationalists are not sufficiently cohesive or numerous to form a viable secessionist movement in Oregon, Idaho, and Washington.

Local resistance could prove an insurmountable problem. The Democrats have carried Washington and Oregon in every presidential election since 1988. Millions of White liberals live in the Vancouver-Seattle-Portland corridor. The coastal region of the Pacific Northwest is one of the most liberal regions of the United States. Obama won 70% of the vote in King County, Washington (Seattle) and 77% of the vote in Multnomah County, Oregon (Portland). I can’t envision a scenario in which diehard Obama voters would flock to the Northwest Front.

The Pacific Northwest doesn’t have a cultural, regional, or ethnic identity comparable to the American South. Whites in Seattle, Tacoma, and Portland don’t feel a sense of kinship with Whites in Boise, Couer d’Alene, and Helena. They didn’t flock to the side of Randy Weaver at Ruby Ridge, Bob Mathews in his shootout in Whidbey Island, or Gordon Kahl in Montana. The Northwest might have a history of Aryan enclave radicalism, but it hasn’t penetrated the surrounding local culture. There isn’t a pre-existing cultural foundation for Whites to rally around.

This can be contrasted to the Antebellum South in the 1850s. Southerners were committed to the preservation of white supremacy. A broad consensus existed in the South that the Union was a compact of sovereign states. A revolutionary vanguard had worked for thirty years to sow the seeds of disunion in South Carolina. The planter class was committed to the preservation of their “domestic institution.” Slavery divided Americans along geographic lines. Secessionists held elected office in all the Southern states. Southerners were united by culture and kinship. Southerners, with their large non-White servile population, had many reasons to fear a “Black Republican” takeover of the federal government.

These vital ingredients are missing in the Pacific Northwest. The region isn’t Ireland, Ukraine, or the Confederacy. Perhaps a band of idealistic Aryan warriors could take up arms against the government and inspire the apathetic masses? The track record of White Nationalist groups like The Order or White Patriot Party doesn’t inspire confidence. The most likely outcome of a government crackdown on an underground vanguardist army would be White Nationalists turning on each and cooperating with the feds like what happened at the Fort Smith Trial.

To his credit, Harold Covington has stressed the importance of character. He is right to focus on this. You can’t build a sand castle with manure. White Nationalists don’t have a sufficient number of men of character to launch a successful secessionist movement anywhere in the United States. Only a fraction of the most diehard White Nationalists would be willing to uproot themselves and relocate to the Pacific Northwest with their families. Only a smaller fraction of them would be willing to risk life and limb for a White homeland.

The federal government is too powerful. I’m less inclined than ever before to believe the system will collapse in the near future. Some have claimed the feds are incompetent. I would argue that they have had a lot of success in penetrating the White Nationalist underground and disrupting our organizations from within. Bill White is going to prison merely for running his mouth. I don’t see anything like a sustained White Nationalist resistance to the federal government (crack one cell, another takes its place) emerging anytime soon.

In our own times, the Northwest Volunteer Army and Northwest Republic properly belong to the realm of fiction. If Covington is serious about this idea, he should focus his energies on practical achievable goals. It would be a huge step forward to get all the racialists who currently reside in the Northwest in regular communication with each other. To my knowledge, the Northwest Front hasn’t progressed that far yet. The next step would be holding state and regional meetings in the real world. The next step after that would be recruiting candidates for a new regional organization.

This organization could then do an exhaustive investigation of local racial attitudes and voting preferences. The Northwest Front could send out some professionally designed direct mail to targeted households sympathetic to traditional cultural values and anti-government rhetoric. It could design a political platform that appeals to a significant cross section of voters in the Northwest and start building a fundraising base. This makes more sense than lashing out at black helicopters with a bazooka. There are a number of steps that come before White Revolution.

I think a Northwest Homeland would be a much tougher mountain to climb than a Southern Homeland. It would be easier to create a base in states like Alabama, Mississippi, and South Carolina where the locals are already receptive to racialism and resent the federal government. The racial diversity of the Deep South provides more opportunity for confrontation and racial combustion. Southerners also have an ethnic identity to fall back on and a tradition of secession.

If Harold Covington is interested, this is a debate we should be having.

Polygynous Evolutionist

This is a hazy recollection, but isn’t there some strong statistical correlation between being to the North and winning wars? Canada beating the US in 1812; the North winning against the South in the Civil War; Russia over Germany; etc.
Nordicreb

The first front in the “war” is the cultural and social front, which is exactly what you are doing, Hunter. I would also suggest cultural associations, such as “The X County Group for European Cultural Heritage”.

The second front is the political one. A3P is trying, although I’m not sure if that front is ready to be opened yet.

Only when those fronts are opened and going well AND when there are enough of us to make a difference in a county or state, is the business of “a homeland” or “secession” even worth looking at.
Louis

Perhaps this shouldn’t be a big concern relative to all the other challenges we face, but there is a supervolcano located at Yellowstone that would wipe out virtually all the inhabitants and life in the Pac NW if it went off.
Greg Johnson

Hunter’s argument points toward a dilemma: If whites need the presence of a sufficient number of non-whites to become race conscious, then the presence of these non-whites will impede the formation of a white ethnostate. If whites live in an area that is sufficiently racially homogeneous to form an ethnostate, they will not develop the racial consciousness necessary to pursue that goal. In neither case is it likely that we will form a state of our own.

In the former case, the ethnostate could arise only if we were willing to be cruel and ruthless enough to expel millions of non-whites. That is certainly possible, but not highly likely. For all their racial consciousness, the South did not spend one millionth the effort working to separate from blacks that they spent on separating from their white cousins to the North. And those organizations fighting to preserve a connection to the Confederacy delight in maintaining grudges against Northern whites to this day but would have us believe that the South was teeming with non-white and Jewish Confederates.

In the latter scenario, the ethnostate could emerge only if we are able to develop racial consciousness to a high level without direct exposure to non-whites. This seems a more likely scenario. There was a time when whites understood the black and yellow and Red Indian perils without having direct contact with these peoples.

Both courses require heroic struggles, but the path toward the formation of an ethnostate in a homogeneously white area of the country seems more likely to me. I have a personal attachment to the Northwest, but beyond that, I hope that separatist movements form in every predominantly white area of the country, from New England to the Pacific Northwest. When the empire falls, I would like to see 60 sovereign entities in North America, the bulk of them homogeneously white and free of Jewish interference.
Charles Martel

If you think that non-whites are in lesser quanitities in these regions I guess you have never been to Tacoma Washington or Downtown Portland Oregon. WWII supplanted plenty of blacks when it “behooved their interests” acrossed multiple west coast ports.

And, yes, HAC is a delusional neurotic that lives in a fantasy world of his own pea-brain conception. There is a reason why he has been actively ostracized from “the movement”. It’s for good reason.
Of course there are plenty of jew-front groups like prothink, hufschmid and the lindstedt/visser/finck contingent that continue to prop HAC up. You’re missing the mark in recognizing this. It is because it is in their interest(s).

You are, however, absolutely correct in your (generic) assertion that running off to some fantasy homeland ideology would solve everything, because it won’t.

Sadly, real answers and contingencies are not readily proposed by anyone in this so-called “movement”. And that is because it doesn’t exist.
Greg Johnson

Portland and Seattle are the whitest large cities in the US. Those are objective facts, not subjective impressions.

You really need some quality control with the comments here. The brass, and worse, is going to drive out the gold.
Northwest resident

This is a very good post, Hunter. I live in the northwest, and you are right about the racial feelings people have here. They are not liberal, “anti-racist” or white racial. There is no concept of race to people here, and the reason is because of the lack of any significant numbers of problematic non-whites. Most of the minorities here are mostly well-behaving Asians.

It’s wrong to say people here are full of liberal-race fantasies and the like, there isn’t even that because it is mostly white homogeneous. Everything else you said is right as well. If Covington can make the Northwest idea into reality, then it will certainly have relevance regardless if it isn’t the best area in terms of indigenous white racialism.
Cadre

I question that 30,000 White Nationalist number. How did they arrive at that number? There are ten times that number that visit sites like Stormfront alone. I think the real number of White Nationalists and people sympathetic to White Nationalism is in the millions. It sounds like a good idea to me to concentrate our people in one area and soon because the nation will pretty soon bleed Whites moving to other countries. I myself at times have seriously considered moving to Argentina.
icr

HW claims that they are still partially intact racially-conscious white communities in the Deep South. If this is true, then educated pro-white whites in those areas need to come forward and start running for school board and other local government offices. What is said in private has to be said in public or the tradition will die out within a generation.

The PNW seems to have been thoroughly purged of whatever little white racialist sentiment it had. It still looks like a good area for recruiting anti-government activists of the Alex Jones and Constitution Party variety. At one time- in the pre-OKC days-people of the that stripe saw nothing wrong about making common cause with WN/CI types. Now they seem thoroughly indoctrinated in anti-racist ideology.

In short, as Barry Goldwater said after voting against the 1964 Civil Rights Act: “You have to go where the ducks are.”
ATBOTL

I can’t believe I’m reading this from you, HW. Harold Covington is a true psychopath, like Jim Jones or Ted Bundy. If he had the charisma to pull it off, he would be leading some kind of cult group. That’s what he has been trying to do in his political career, but without much success. His goal is to gather followers for his own gratification.

We talked about how Linder had narcissistic traits, which is like a milder version of psychopathy. Covington is the full blown syndrome. I wanted to puke when you mentioned that he was talking about “character.” Psychopaths typically speak in high minded rhetoric as a way of gaining trust and admiration from others. Please, do some research into this man’s history. He was on here a little while ago posing as someone else who was advocating his own writings. Do not underestimate how effective a man like Covington can be at manipulating people. Do not give him any kind of platform to operate or you will be sorry.

BTW, Covington is not delusional or neurotic, he is psychopathic. It’s his total lack of neurosis(ie anxiety) that allows him and others like him to lie so shamelessly. Psychopaths have have high self confidence and grandiose ambitions, which are not the same thing as the delusions suffered by psychotic individuals.

Turning to the issue at hand, if the Deep South is such fertile group for white nationalism, why is it not more of a force there already? The CofCC has been working for decades there. Maybe you should get involved with them. I like your idea about targeting Southern college students, but let’s face it, they are not very political, let alone ideological.

As GJ notes, the South poses its own set of challenges to WN. One of them is the hatred that they have for northern whites. On Stormfront, this often comes out as gloating when bad things happen to Northern whites and blaming the North for everything, including the presence of blacks in the South. Another problem is that most Southerners still think that the GOP is the solution to every problem. I don’t think Southerners are ready to join radical moments because they still see the right wing face of the establishment as being on their side. Nowhere has the conservative kool-aid been drunk more deeply than in the South. To reach these people, you will have to swim against the currents of multi-racial Evangelical Christianity, Christian Zionism and Fox News Patriotardism. All of these movements are are powerful and infest every nook and cranny of the typical Southern mind. You will have to fight “Jesus is the solution to everything” and “we should vote for Palin” at every turn.

I think that whites in “Greater California,” which includes Arizona and Nevada, have much potential. I also think there is potential is in Northern cities with histories of “racial tension,” like Detroit, Philadelphia, Boston and Cincinnati. The racially aware people in these places are not so distracted by religion and they tend believe that no one in the mainstream represents their interests.
Kievsky

Hunter,

The US is going bankrupt, and bankruptcy must lead to a lower level of complexity.

Government jobs are used as a higher paid form of welfare for the gold-plated blacks. This is highly unsustainable, and we now have a contracting global economy. You should pay more attention to the economic news, Hunter. You’d be more optimistic.

http://www.alternativeright.com/main/the-magazine/the-siren-song-of-diversity/

Statistics on this “blackening” of the government workforce confirm what many know from their humdrum encounters with the government. EEOC figures show that between 1980 and 2005, the number of blacks in city and state government rose from 619,000 to 1.1 million, an increase of 481,000 (U.S. Statistical Abstract 2009, Table 446). A recent detailed study of black employment at federal agencies found almost universal massive over-representation. This is especially true where job requirements are modest. So, for example, in the U.S. Court Services and Offender Services, blacks compared to their general population numbers were over-represented by 808 percent. Remarkably, over-representation also existed in more “technical” agencies: NASA (49.4 percent), National Science Foundation (318.2 percent), Security and Exchange Commission (112.6 percent) and the Nuclear Regulatory Commission (68.3 percent). To be sure, many of these “black” positions in technically-oriented agencies may be menial, for example, custodial work or clerking. Even so, the pattern is unmistakable—government to the rescue.

The implications of this dynamic are profound. The ceaseless pressure for tougher anti-discrimination laws will make blacks affordable only to the deep pocket employers or those doing business with government where workforce diversity is compulsory. The costliness of black private-sector employees also means that the burden of affirmative action far, far exceeds the salaries of newly hired employees. Moreover, as lawyers discover new types of once hidden racial discrimination, the cost of litigation-proofing the workplace will become astronomical (this can already be seen in turning corporate HR departments over to blacks so as to pre-empt law suits). Running parallel will be commensurate pressure to fill yet more government jobs with blacks who are now even more expensive for private industry. For those worried about burgeoning Hispanic immigration, this dynamic may be unfixable—just try getting blacks to surrender the hard won protection against employment discrimination (this is comparable to giving up a minimum wage).

Going one step further, the public sector transformation means going from blacks being governed by whites to whites, save at the highest administrative levels, being governed by blacks. In other words, yesterday’s short-order cook is today’s assistant school principal or IRS supervisor. How this translates into administrative efficiency is, of course, a complicated issue whose resolution remains murky. Still, the pattern is likely to be a troubling one and short of a massive privatization of government services, the dynamic will continue unabated. African Americans should recall the old Chinese proverb, be careful of what you wish for, you might get it.
Junghans

ATBOTL, the next to the last paragraph in you post #7 says a lot about the problems we face in trying to de-program clueless American Whites. What you have described in that paragraph also holds true in most of the so-called ‘red state flyover country’. On the surface, most White folks are friendly, courteous, helpful, intelligent and culturally solid. Underneath runs a toxic river of ludicrous ideas, beliefs and misconceptions. Besides being ideologically narcotized, they are often times wilfully ignorant about their surreal dilemma. I see this behavior and the racial paradox of the White mindset daily. This is the reality that we are dealing with. Is there an answer or a way? Perhaps, keep the think tanks perking, maybe we will lock onto it.
Jackson

These are for cities, meaning city proper. Obviously metro areas numbers are different.

Portland Demographics:
78.6% White
6.7% Asian
6.6% Black or African American
1.3% American Indian, Alaska Native
0.5% Native Hawaiian, Pacific Islander
2.7% Some other race
3.6% Two or more races
8.5% Total Hispanic/Latino (of any race)

Seattle
67.1% white,
16.6% Asian,
10.0% black,
1.0% Native American,
0.9% Pacific Islander,
2.3% from other races, and
3.4% from two or more races.
6.3% of the Hispanic or Latino of any race

Charlotte, NC (slightly bigger than Seattle)
56.0% White
50.3% were non-Hispanic whites.
33.7% Black
10.6% Hispanic or Latino
0.4% American Indian
4.0%. Asian Americans
0.1% Pacific Islander Americans
1.8% two or more races made

Atlanta, GA (slightly smaller than Portland)
56.8% black
37.7% white
2% Asian
0.2% American Indian
2.3% other races
1.1% two or more races
4.7% of the population were Hispanic or Latino
nash2z

I sincerely doubt that a second segregationist struggle, located in the South, will emerge. Southern resistance during the so-called Civil Rights struggle, while admirable, ultimately collapsed. The collapse represented the last gasp of resistance to post-Civil War Reconstruction. I suppose we could analyze the reasons why to death, but the bottome line are the results. It didn’t work before, there’s no reason to suspect that it will work now, or in the future.
The paradigm needs to shift, and it needs to shift in terms of the possible. Whites need to be made to see that secession – IN ANY FORM – is a realistic possibility. Oddly there are several serious attempts at discussing or implementing secession that are within reach of almost any WN: Texas, Southern Illinois, Vermont/New Hampshire, and the Northwest come to mind.
These attempts at secession must be encouraged. WNs should work them, and let the best model emerge. We’ll deal with the details later. The overall imperative is to foster a sense of disloyalty to the current regime. Ally yourselves with the misguided patriots, the leftist environmentalists, and other potentially racially-concious groups to foster the idea of a breakaway Republic. Our goal should be to have enough of the right type of people believing and working for secession, to be in agreement with secession, in principle.
At the same time, WNs could be forming and organizing as political soldiers, setting ourselves up loosely as an underground revolutionary party, based on a European or Middle Eastern model, keeping in mind the ultimate goal of any successful secessionist movement: a white ethnostate.
The key is to allow the Darwinian struggle to take place between the various secessionist movements. Pick a side, and support it with all of your energy.
Wikitopian

If only there were a man with a bold vision and strikingly good looks who would write a book about secession then fuse that book with practical grassroots politics. He would recognize the importance of building a base of support as an advocate for regular White folks and have a full head of hair under a hip fedora. We would no longer need to debate these things and could rally around him, buying his book and sending his organization our money.
TabuLa Raza

“On the surface, most White folks are friendly, courteous, helpful, intelligent and culturally solid.”
Boy Scout Law
A Scout is:
Trustworthy,
Loyal,
Helpful,
Friendly,
Courteous,
Kind,
Obedient,
Cheerful,
Thrifty,
Brave,
Clean,
and Reverent.
Note that the Boy Scout Oath has traditionally been considered to have three promises. Those three promises are delineated by the semicolons in the Oath, which divide it into three clauses. The three promises of the Scout Oath are, therefore:
Duty to God and country,
Duty to other people, and
Duty to self

DUTY TO GOD AND COUNTRY: Your family and religious leaders teach you to know and serve God. By following these teachings, you do your duty to God.

Men and women of the past worked to make America great, and many gave their lives for their country. By being a good family member and a good citizen, by working for your country’s good and obeying its laws, you do your duty to your country. Obeying the Scout Law means living by its 12 points.

DUTY TO OTHER PEOPLE: Many people need help. A cheery smile and a helping hand make life easier for others. By doing a Good Turn daily and helping when you’re needed, you prove yourself a Scout and do your part to make this a better world.

DUTY TO SELF: Keeping yourself physically strong means taking care of your body. Eat the right foods and build your strength. Staying mentally awake means learn all you can, be curious, and ask questions. Being morally straight means to live your life with honesty, to be clean in your speech and actions, and to be a person of strong character.
>>”For the country” means “for the federal government,” which is not to be challenged.
This is what amounts to philosophy for the rubes.
MY Boy Scout Law:
A scout is suspicious of all governments, and knows they are ruled by evil special interests.
A scout is willing to fight and kill for freedom of the White race, at a moment’s notice
>>The scouts are to be duty-bound and obedient?
That means they should suck the dick of any would-be tyrant, and not complain. And here we are. The basic rule- be nice, and never rock the boat.
“By following these teachings, you do your duty to God.”
I see. Blind submission to the federal meatgrinder (“the country”) is the highest virtue. Horsehit- the country was started precisely by not submitting to the Crown.
So the bottom line of this thought control is- challenging the state is like flipping off G-d.
Heinous Henry

“As a consequence, Whites in the area have less daily exposure to the horrors of diversity and are less racially conscious than their counterparts elsewhere.”

As some-one born in Portland I can tell you that there are ALOT of White liberals who have moved up here from the ‘mestizo mess’ of California. White Flight.

The presence of these White Flight types (who are very uncomfortable in discussing the reason they left Mexi-fornia) really off-sets alot of the more normal ethno-centric Whites. For example there is a long tradition in this area of being very distrustful of the ‘eastern establishment’ (code for Jewry).
nash2z

Arguing about which effort at secessionist is most viable is a healthy thing, I guess, as it assumes we have all agreed upon the necessity of secession. Wallaces’ thoughts on the South are convincing. Covington’s vision for the Northwest is compelling. One looks at the secessionist stirrings in Vermont and New Hampshire almost with a Hegelian “I could see this happening there” certainty. Texas has a history as an independent republic, and Texans actually remember this – note Gov. Perry’s secessionist talk, and its failure (or success) in raising any eyebrows from Texans.

The federal government will go one of two ways: it will either continue to fail to meet its former domestic obligations, placing the burden on individual States to do what they can to survive….or they will take over vast areas of control formerly held by the States in return for bankrolling, and mismanage it (see Wiki’s post). The end result? The people will either be pulled or pushed towards a separation with the government in Washington. In fact, this has already been happening for some time, its how we ended up with a black president, a further sign of White desperation.

Now we see the abovementioned (simultaneous) mushrooming of several secessionist movements, scattered throughout he US. This represents the next step on the continum, leading to massive white disilliusionment with the experiment formerly called the ‘United States’. As WN’s, our antennae need to be receptive to what’s really happening – now – on the ground. Our position is not as glum as some would have it. But we need to be poised to leverage these unusual events, and harness the energy contained within. After all, at this discontent’s core is racial energy. We are the priests who must channel it, and direct it.
Simmons

A “homeland” idea is a pretty poor excuse for not dealing with our demoralization problems. So imagine it setup as a viable entity, how long before it crumbles to the word “racist” and “racism?” Even the Jews are having a hard time with those words and they practically invented them for demonizing whites.

First things first, come to understand The Mantra and the implications of our impending genocide, and then deal with the vermin who use the words “racist” and “racism” to further this genocide of our race, the white race.
Hunter Wallace

We are going to do a series of articles on the Northwest Homeland.
jack Ryan

I think Covington is an excellent writer and the Northwest migration is a solid program, it’s something that can be DONE, attempted as opposed to WN just whining all the time and lamenting the supposed fact that “nothing can be done”.
I see great possibilities with the NW migration. It will be rugged, working class Whites who live off the land Whites contesting for political, cultural power in the Pacific Northwest and rich White liberals living on the coast make for good targets for our kind of people, we don’t need tens of millions of Black Africans for our people to become fighting Rednecks – which is really what we want.
The Pacific NorthWest already has a fine tradition of White men and women (Vicky Weaver) standing up to the Beast and fighting/resisting.
I think it is a great option and another very positive thing about the North West Migration is that it gives hope to Whites in other parts of America to resist in their locals as so many of our people are without hope.
Let’s get some WN to make a sacred monastery on the exact spot where Vickie Weaver was murdered by the BATF assassins. These sacred parts of the Pacific Northwest can be like Kosovo for Serbs – and the Serbs in all parts of Serbia fought for Kosovo.
Trainspotter

“I’m less inclined than ever before to believe the system will collapse in the near future.”

I wouldn’t have so much confidence in the system. I recently saw jaw dropping numbers on the federal debt. The Congressional Budget Office claims the following:

“The new report predicts that debt held by investors, including China, would spike from $7.5 trillion at the end of last year to $20.3 trillion in 2020. That means interest payments would more than quadruple — from $209 billion this year, to $916 billion by the end of the decade.”

916 billion dollars a year by the end of the decade. Amazing, and that’s just the interest on the national debt. Income taxes typically don’t bring in much more than that. Further, this will happen at a time when the Baby Boomers have retired en masse, creating a crushing burden for Social Security and Medicare. I’m sure the numbers for those programs are equally horrible and unsustainable.

Of course, this leaves out a whole host of other problems that the system faces, some of which are every bit as serious as the ones above. But just looking at the math, the things that are easy to quantify, the picture for the system is horrific.

And it’s happening fast. Remember, these projections aren’t for 2050 or 2100. This just gets us to 2020.

No way is this sustainable. Not a chance in hell. Hunter, I really believe that your confidence in the system is misplaced, but one thing is certain: big changes are on the way. Really big changes. If the system does survive, which I rather doubt, it will emerge as a very different system than that which we are accustomed to.

As an interesting aside, it is my understanding that during Islam’s aggressive growth phase, one of the big selling points was that when a town converted to Islam, its debts were erased. One can certainly see the appeal. Will something similar play out here, where some sort of withdrawal from the system will be the only way to escape crushing and unsustainable debt loads?

The mind does wander.
Trainspotter

I’m a big fan of Covington’s four books on the Northwest Republic. I highly recommend them. Covington is an insightful guy on many issues. He’s hinted at writing a fifth book that would deal with the early building phase of the Northwest Republic. I really hope he does that. It could be invaluable.

Having said that, while I wish such a movement well, I think that it is ultimately in error. What follows is not advocacy, simply an exploration of hypotheticals. I’ve spelled this out before, and probably will do so again, but for now I’ll just say this: look at a map.

Look at a demographic map. Then look at a red state/blue state map, broken down by county (not just state). Then tell me if it makes sense for white nationalists to concede, right off the bat, a vast hinterland of whites that stretches over most of the North American continent – especially in the age of Fourth Generation Warfare. The reality is that the heart of our opposition is in the Boston/Washington Corridor (BosWash). Throw in a few other enclaves, particularly along the West Coast, and there you have it. Our opposition should end up with the small enclaves, not us. The map tells quite a story.

But really, it’s all rather moot. The truth is that if the Northwest movement went Big Time, white resistance would spread. Especially in the age of Fourth Generation Warfare, this would be almost inevitable. The solidarity and cohesiveness of 1860 is no longer required for success (which is a good thing, because it is probably unattainable any time soon). Instead, small numbers of men (given the right circumstances) can have enormous impact. We won’t see the mass armies of yesteryear, and they aren’t necessary.

In Covington’s fictional universe, this spread of white resistance doesn’t happen. There is no mention of white resistance outside of the Northwest, as best as I can recall.

I seriously doubt that this would be the case in the real world. Resistance would spread, and the result would be something more in accord with the real demographic and political distribution that exists on this continent. That’s my prediction anyway. So maybe it will be the Northwest that gets the party started. Who knows? That won’t be how things end, though. No way.
Tom Watson

Escapist fiction.
Josiah Tattnall

How long can the nation hold together? It has already collapsed. All that holds us together is the economy, which too severe blows when the goal of giving every minority a home clashed with the reality of minorities making payments on said homes.

The commercial real estate collapse will be much worse.

I have been all over this “nation” and have found the most solid racists to reside in the south (primarily South Carolina, Georgia, Tennessee and Alabama).

Our hope is that we can use the internet to forge small groups who are prepared to take charge when the Federal Government can no longer pay our creditors.

So many scenarios could possibly unfold at any given moment:

1. Iran is attacked by Israel, causing oil to spike to $200/ a barrel.
2. The Royal Family of Saudi Arabia loses favor and a violent overthrow occurs, signaling a hard line Islamic government in that country.
3. China dumps Treasury Bills, flooding the global market (and dooming themselves in the process).
4. The unimaginable….

We live in times that truly call for Dr. Sam Francis’ pen to still be flowing with venom directed at our enemies. Alas, he died five years ago.

But the fact remains, WN have been correct with all of our predictions… the only one that remains left to come true is the economic collapse.

Sure, in some form or fashion we have been saying it for longer than I’ve been alive, but for all intents and purposes, this is the only impediment we have left to finally secure a future for our people.

Keep up the great work. This is a debate (secession) that must be on our minds daily.
paco

These vital ingredients are missing in the Pacific Northwest. The region isn’t Ireland, Ukraine, or the Confederacy.

Southern WA / northern OR do in fact constitute the 25th oblast of Ukraine, but don’t look to them for racial support.
Greg Johnson

Some short, controlled bursts:

1. As has been mentioned, the NW is experiencing an influx of racially-conscious whites from California. Yes, a lot of these whites are culturally and politically liberal. But any form of white nationalism that takes off on the West Coast is going to be far different than White Nationalism in the deep South. West Coast White Nationalism will probably be culturally and politically liberal: green, historically preservationist, very much into walkable communities, anti-big business, pro-abortion, pro-drug legalization, anti-corporation and anti-chain store, more tolerant of gays, etc. AND also White Nationalist. It will be more like Dutch White Nationalism than German White Nationalism. Fine. Anything to save the race. Let a thousand flowers bloom.

2. I have family in the Pacific Northwest. They are liberals. They make a FETISH of liking blacks. They voted for Obama, and they were upset that many of their fellow white liberals voted for him but we not enthusiastic about him being the first Black president. That I think is interesting. The reason a lot of the NW went for Obama is that the area is liberal, but a lot of the liberals are not race fetishists. They just voted for the Donkeycrat. Some of these people are California refugees, some NW natives.

YET, for all my relatives’ dismaying Negrophilia, they are also Jew-wise, Mexican-wise, and Asian-wise — although they talk about it in hushed tones. If they were forced to choose between their liberalism and multiracialism — and ultimately white liberalism is just a white thing — then they would choose their liberalism. They need a Pim Fortuyn, not a Harold Covington to pose that alternative. (Or Covington needs to play up his belief in reincarnation and play down his hatred of gays.)

3. The South might become neo-segregationist. But that is not White Nationalism. Will the South ever become White Nationalist? For all Southerners despise Blacks, can they ever get along without them? Food for thought.
Greg Johnson

A couple more bursts:

4. Trainspotter is right: White secessionism should not be confined to the NW. I think that Covington is concerned that there are not enough people to make it happen all across the country, hence his desire to concentrate forced in the NW. But since a lot of our people are not going to do that no matter what, I think it is good to encourage them to be agents for secession in their local areas. In the end, I think that the US will break up into 60 or so sovereign states, based on existing states and homogeneous regions within states. The non-whites and liberals will end up concentrated in the blue areas.

5. But damn it, cities like Seattle, Portland, and San Francisco are too nice to cede to the enemy.

6. The best but least likely model for separation in the birth of Singapore. The Malays drew a line around the largest Chinese population in their country and said: “You are independent. You will no longer influence our destiny.” Hiving off the blue areas would be alalogous.

7. After Bush’s re-election, I was delighted by the “blue state secession” talk. Let them secede. If we tried to secede, the same liberal assholes would be demanding war lest we mistreat their totemic non-white “OTHERS.”

8. Great point about Islam and debt repudiation, Trainspotter. Two major planks of a WN movement should be (a) repudiation of debt and (b) affordable family formation. Every American child is born a peon to the Chinese and other bondholders. The children of the White Nationalist state will be born free and in debt to no Jew or other foreigner. Is that so hard to sell?
White Preservationist

A recent piece in The Guardian advocating for the secession and founding of ‘Cascadia’ – “A world away from Texas: There are calls for Oregon, Washington and British Columbia to split from the US and Canada. Cascadia is not a bad idea” — http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2010/feb/28/cascadia-independence-america-canada-washington
Dave Logsdon

If you want people to join your movement (sympathetic to your cause or not) you have to offer them something practical and immediate. When are you guys going to pay attention to the blue collar component of WN? People join because it gives them some ability to do something, and or some protections that they don’t possess outside of the organization. Back in the early 60’s or late 50’s you may have been able to build around common goals exclusively in the political or ideological realm but no more. In those days a man’s job and family safety were still not commonly jeopardized by his political affiliations regarding race. Today you just make yourself a target by attending conferences or using your real name. Certainly this public front of the battle is worth doing but it is being done by Jarred Taylor, Kevin McDonald, Gordon Baum, and others. Those people have the rhetorical skills, academic credentials and a relatively safe source of income with which to pursue those risks. With the exception of perhaps Gordon they all likely have a significant retainer in a high profile civil defense attorney. For the blue collar pro white who is under employed or unemployed or will never progress above his current level because of his race in a large company he can’t afford even one mistake. Harold Covington is correct when he promotes trying to look back to our great grandfather’s strengths. Adaptation is necessary but re-invention every generation is not. Local micro affiliations that build members economic security and help to re-enforce the resistance to the brain-washing their families must cope with are practical can be grown one group at a time to eventually connect in months or years. Until the anti-white political forces can effectively control our private and personal associations there is minimal risk and a concrete gain in the short term for the WN and in the midterm for the movement. See the networking section (Eastern Dixie) on the C of CC site for suggestions on building these micro connections.
In close perhaps a little quote (by David Lane) to the young bulls to bring perspective on HAC since his name alone seems to create dissention:
“This internal and seemingly eternal bickering within the ranks of groups and individuals who claim to care about stopping the genocide being practiced against the White race in every Western nation must end. It is counter-productive and thus, serves the tyrant. . .
If you feel a leader or a group is involved in a constructive project or has valuable literature that you can use for the cause, you can send money anonymously or use a false name. Is that not better than making a decision on some slander, when in all honesty; there is no way to know if it is true? If the leader is a provocateur, you have now used that portion of his game which is beneficial to our side. If he is one of us, you have supported him and our cause, and you have not falsely slandered him. You have protected yourself, not only from the possibility of his being an enemy agent, but from the results of the enemy intercepting mail unbeknownst to anyone. And finally, you have not played into the tyrant’s hands by giving the resistance the appearance of dissension.”

Good luck
David Logsdon
See Something Say Something

Generally, I’m pan-secessionist for Americans in general. There’s a number of movements: Texas, Dixie, Cascadia, New Hampshire, a Christian state in South Carolina, etc. I support them all.

But there’s a danger to secession, a bunch of smaller states will be that much more vulnerable to not just foreign military conquest, but also general intrusion by globalist forces, political and economic. Perhaps that inevitable though.

As was said on the other thread, most of flyover country outside of Dixie is still heavily, overwhelmingly white, and white people should not give up all that land. I know for a fact there is an organized effort underway right now to resettle non-whites in specifically rural white areas, up to and including media propaganda campaigns about them “creating jobs” etc. That must be stopped.

GJ’s comments about Singapore are interesting, that’s exactly what we could do here – get NYC to secede. (Call it Israel West, it essentially is anyway)

As for repudiating debt – folks, End the Fed. Thanks to Ron Paul that’s now a mainstream, respectable opinion. Bankers are hated now more than ever, the white movement should really capitalize (lol) on that.

I mean – Bernie Madoff – was that not a gift straight from heaven to provide a Visual Aide for the Jewish problem? Yet still, WN seemed to have failed to properly leverage that particular potential propaganda opportunity.

Some say that we should underplay the Jewish problem and focus on blacks and mestizos and the like. I think the opposite is true, by clearly distinguishing our interests from Jewish interests, you “wake up” whites to their interests as opposed to the interests of others. The worst danger to the movement is pointless diversions into kosher conservatism and the like.
Cowardly Creep

This website seems to be based on some type of naive idealism of white racism. Does civilization run on money, greed, and hypocrisy? I say “Yes.” Why do whites need white racism? The answer might be “Obama today — Mugabe tomorrow.” Napoleon and Hitler made many mistakes. Napoleon said, in translation, “I am for the whites because I am white. If I were black then I would be for the blacks.” Hitler thought about creating a super race and conquering Europe. However, was it a good idea to pursue both those goals simultaneously? Doesn’t logic dictate creating a super race FIRST and then worrying about conquest? Whites are now a shrinking minority attacked by black, mulatto, and mestizo street fighters at the bottom and by leftist Jewish and Asian manipulators at the top. Shouldn’t whites try to create a new white-derived species with, say, 3 times the intelligence of such Jews as Einstein or Feynman? The small number of white racist fanatics could then be running dogs of a truly intelligent super species. Doesn’t logic dictate that those with superior weapons are likely to win? What weapon is superior to intelligence?
Tom

With all this talk of secession in different states like the Deep South, Texas, Vermont and the Pacific Northwest, why isn’t it possible to take the whole country back? European Whites are still the majority in this country and if you look on a map the greatest concentration of minorities are along the southern border of the US, the black belt in the South and the area incorporating Washington DC/Newark/Philadelphia/NYC, a relatively small area compared to the rest of the country. We make up about 60 percent of the population but if you exclude the illegal immigrants, foreign students, green card holders and all the other interlopers that are added to our population count we are about 70 percent of the population. We also have a number of Christian Arabs, Syrians and Lebanese, many that came through Ellis Island and have been culturally Europeanised, and although not Europid they do identify as White. There are White Hispanics out there of unmixed European ancestry who would also join us. Such a political union would comprise about 75 percent of the population and is more than enough to thwart any black/brown/yellow coalition put together by the demon seed. We can take back this country with the right alliances or at least keep the majority of it. I wouldn’t worry too much about progressive White liberals. Their love of diversity is shallow and for political expediency only. When push comes to shove they can either side with us or join the others and be outnumbered by their beloved minority charges.
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Greg Johnson

Contra Tom, I don’t think I would want to take all of America back, even if it were handed to us, which of course it won’t be. I think we would have more to gain by some serious reshuffling and cutting of the deck.
MGLS

I also disagree with Tom, who echoes Sam Francis’s call for a white cultural “reconquest” of a multiracial America (Richard McCulloch’s reply to Francis on this subject is here in the June 1995 issue of American Renaissance). When different groups occupy the same territory, intermixture is inevitable. An exclusive territory is the only way to secure continued racial existence. What we want is a racial rearrangement, a partition of the United States in which we and other groups peacefully go our separate ways and pursue our own destinies on our own independent states.

Anyone who is averse to the cession of territory ought to keep in mind that what matters is the people, not the land. Securing racial independence and preservation is our goal, not defining down the term “white” and trying to maintain political control over the United States.
Polygynous Evolutionist

Cowardly Creep,

Good inquiry and reasoning. Yes, a few people are working on related matters. Check out this post and thread:

http://www.occidentaldissent.com/2010/02/08/monkeys-on-the-moon/

The different focus that people have are not always mutually exclusive.

There is something superior to intelligence if by intelligence you just mean IQ, yes. But of course there is really nothing superior to a superior mind.
Sebastian Ernst Ronin

The WN movement is not a social driver; it is an agent. The driver will be Post-Peak Oil collapse. If the physical infrastructure collapses, then the institutional infrastucture will follow suit, the institution of the industrial nation-state inclusive.

The WN demogrpahic, NAmerican secessionist demographic and Post-Peak Oil demographic are yet three ships bypassing each other in the night. Each needs each. As long as they remain isolated and divided, they remain impotent.

A major challenge for Americans (not so much for Canadians) is to abandon state identities to begin to perceive/create regional identities. Dixie, Texas, Cascadia and Novacadia are well on the way. Personally, I would place resources and energy on Dixie, followed by Cascadia.
Silver

Anyone who is averse to the cession of territory ought to keep in mind that what matters is the people, not the land. Securing racial independence and preservation is our goal, not defining down the term “white” and trying to maintain political control over the United States.

Yeah, if it keeps going that way before long Don Black’s going to have to add a Stormfront Tamil Nadu subforum.

Nevertheless, Tom and people like “Diablo Blanco” (or rather Diablo Moreno, if you’ve seen the pic) and his misleadingly named “Pan-Aryan Front” have something of a point in that a caucasoidal form provides some sense of racial familiarity, particularly when contrasted against negroids and mongoloids, and if there’s a sufficiently high degree of ‘cultural competence’ (similar accent, similar values, similar interests etc) one can always squint and tell himself yeah it’s all the same thing. But apart from the rarest instances I doubt there is any real racial ‘infeeling’ there, and certainly nothing that can compare to what one derives from one’s ethnicity.

In saying what matters is the people not the land, obviously you have to take a stand at some point, otherwise you could just go on ceding N. America forever, taking ‘comfort’ in the thought that maybe Iceland or the Orkney Islands will provide a refuge — since, after all, what matters is the people not the land.

And then there is the issue of trust; why would anyone trust you? You know, you get rid of the niggers today, you’ll be getting rid of me tomorrow. Anyone with half a brain can see that. And anyone with a half a brain can see that you’re only pleading and bargaining now because the hoped for ‘great awakening’ never took place and seems it will never take place and that it’s dawned on you that it’s better to salvage something (and live to perhaps fight another day) than to wait it out and lose it all. But trust, MG, trust, there’s no trust there. You’re like a victim pleading with the mugger that if he lets you go you won’t call the cops; but the minute he’s out of sight the first thing you do is call the cops. What kind of an idiot would consider all the hatred and rage of VNN or Stormfront and conclude that these people can be trusted? It seems the only thing you’re capable of promising is misery and suffering.
Mark

“Diablo Blanco” (or rather Diablo Moreno, if you’ve seen the pic) and his misleadingly named “Pan-Aryan Front” have something of a point in that a caucasoidal form provides some sense of racial familiarity, particularly when contrasted against negroids and mongoloids, and if there’s a sufficiently high degree of ‘cultural competence’ (similar accent, similar values, similar interests etc) one can always squint and tell himself yeah it’s all the same thing.

They have no point. Quadroon and mestizo “Caucasoids” don’t offer racial familiarity, only to those who are too far gone already like Diablo. He represents Latin and Semitic values, that of blood communion, not purity. They have ruined themselves and their own countries, and I want no part of it. They only increase the non-white problem, which we are dealing with today with the mestizo “Caucasoid” invasion.
Captainchaos

Filthy, greasy wogs.
Silver

Mark, I don’t think they’re talking about mestizos and quadroons. And I didn’t say I agreed with them or suggest that you should (Diablo’s a complete nutter); I said he had “something of a point,” in the sense that most whites unthinkingly going through their lives would be unlikely to think too much differently of a, say, Omar Sharif if he spoke and behaved in a manner similar to them. If anything, I would guess that it’d be the kind of interaction they’d recall to reassure themselves that all is well on hearing the kind of remarks Cap’nchaos is wont to make. (In their minds, “That guy was different; the interaction went all; multiracialism is fine.”)
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phil white

Quoting Dr. Johnson’s comment:

“:If whites need the presence of a sufficient number of non-whites to become race conscious, then the presence of these non-whites will impede the formation of a white ethnostate. If whites live in an area that is sufficiently racially homogeneous to form an ethnostate, they will not develop the racial consciousness necessary to pursue that goal. In neither case is it likely that we will form a state of our own. ”
Any white ethno state in America will be a beacon to the surviving whites in the other states.
It is no accident that Jewish interest try to eliminate any pure ethnostate in the world.
The problem with the South is the large number of Jimmy Carter whites. An attempt to expel 15 million or so Southern blacks would arouse liberal instincts. Also much of the lower South is not fit habitation for Scotch Irish. All we siblings have had skin cancers.
Machiavellie said that in politics there are no perfect solutions. Each has it’s draw backs.
What might work is a region with enough non-whites to serve as graphic examples of the problems, but not enough to cause real political resistance. The Pacific Northwest fits that bill.
One technique could be to take your home school bus full of 12 years olds on a tour of down town Portland or Seattle, then return to your rural town so the kids can share their thoughts on the experience.
We will surely be aided, where ever white political soldiers set up, by the coming recovery of racial consciousness by most white Americans.
I think that white America is about to under go a civilizational change of attitude. That is what happened in the Soviet Union which went from Communism to Cowboy Capitalism in five years.
The Russians ened up with a state that was 80% Russian where the Soviet state was 50% Russian.
Assuming that is what will happen to America, the task of a pure ethno state will be to broadcast to Radio Free White America for the forty years it will take to finish the attitued adjustment job continent wide.
Also as Dr. Johnson noted, you don’t necessarily have to have high doses of racial exposure. White’s stopped Oriental immigration when it only consisted of about 200,000 Asians on the Pacific coast.
Also Jews were only 1% of the population of Weimar Germany. A little optimism please.
Lastly, it doesn’t take that many political soldiers. The Communist Party in Russia had only 100,000 members in a populaiton of 160,000,000 when they launched the October Revolution.
Pig Red

I’m about 2 months late to this discussion, but I just wanted to add a short note.

Whites should be less worried about living with like-minded ‘nationalists’ and more worried about living somewhere safe. There will be plenty of time for prosthelytizing when and if the blood starts flowing in the streets, which I doubt will happen. This will probably remain a low-level civil war that will not touch certain geographic locations. The northwest is one of those location so the more whites who move there the better, regardless of their racial views.

Short version: Go where it’s white. Worry about the politics later. Don’t put the cart before the horse.

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