Katrina V.D. Heuvel, Communist-American Princess, calls the GOP male, pale and stale.
This writer at The Nation is shrewish
She lives in a city that’s Bluish
Her condo is gated
It’s not integrated
Even White Goyim are fewish
My point is not really newish
But the only free “White” folks are Jewish
They’re free to show hatred
Until Whites are all mated
With Blacks and the country is zooish
Poem by astute OD commenter “Discard” thanks!
Well, since my comment was deleted, here is my revised response to Barb: I do not think forced sterilization is a fair measure to test one’s worth.
spooky,
“one guy just ruined the whole thread.” this pat buchanan fan is sorry to spoil the party, but really what percentage of threads at OD turn into debates? A fairly large percentage, I’d say. This has always been an open forum, and it showcases the large range of opinion among people whose commonality, as I see it, is a basic understanding that a thing called “white America” exists, that it is a good thing, and that it is in some sense endangered and in need of preservation.
roach,
your response reminds me of mearshimer’s recent speech in which he divides jewry between “righteous Jews” and “neo-Afrikaners.” Which is fine by me, although I fail to see how people who support white ethnonationalism like you (and me) have much truck with principled anti-ethnocentrists like Finkelstein (or Chomsky). These latter two basically see Jews the same way Tim Wise sees white people. And I doubt they disagree with Wise on how whites ought to act and feel about themselves.
my interest is in neither the anti-white jewish agitators nor the pro-WN jews that could fill up a single applebee restaurant, but in the millions of people who make the vast majority of jews and crypto-jews: largely apolitical ordinary citizens who abide by civilized norms. They don’t run newspapers or movie companies or banks, don’t give money to the ADL or SPLC, don’t do anything “anti-white” except join millions of non-Jewish whites in voting Democratic or neocon Republican.
The way to treat them fairly, which will have the added benefit of making WN more morally attractive to the millions of whites who also have no problem with individual Jews, is to draw a sharp distinction between attacking the agenda of organized Jewry, which is acceptable and necessary, and seeking to limit the future rights of individual citizens who happen to be Jewish, which is not.
Kievsky,
I don’t think I’m whining, but I overall like your last comment, particularly the last paragraph. Your vision of a decentralised nation sounds like a good place to live!
Another gem on the shabbos goy-boy daddy of the ‘Red Princess’ –
” even after Paul Gottfried, Marcus Epstein, Tanstaafl’s wife, myself and other cryptos are compelled to join “our tribe” ”
And my cousin!
For the very small number of right wing Jews and the very large # of “mischling” families, I think the take home lesson is this: if the shit hits the fan, it will be very bad for us.
We need to work like our lives depend on it, (and they probably do), to make sure White Americans, and particularly Old-Stock White Americans, and even more particularly working class Old-Stock White Americans, get a square deal in the USA.
A revived Paleoconservative movement must take over the Republican Party, which must in turn take control of the government and end immigration, end neocon imperialism, end aid to Israel, end anarcho-tyranny, end affirmative action (or classify Jews and Euros separately, and set the quotas accordingly!), rollback the sexual revolution, and restore power to the states and local communities.
The Paleoconservatives were ahead of their time. Now that Bush’s New World Order globalism has been in place for 2 decades and proved itself to be a failure, Americans should finally be ready to give the Buchanan platform a try. (Libertarian domination of the Republican Party is bound to be stillborn. The people want Arizona-type legislation, not a guy named “Rand” who calls dishonestly labels TARP-kleptocracy “socialism”, blames the Fed for all ills and is more concerned for Muslim terrorists being waterboarded in G. than for White American men facing the far worse torture of Black gang-rape in our prisons at home.)
Be the change you want to see in the world, Crypto! Run for Congress, win, and implement the Paleo platform! Now is the time to do and dare!
I would make Marcus Epstein an honorary Aryan.
Spooky wrote: One guy just ruined the whole thread, the whole sense of comeraderie, and the whole sense that we were moving forward for ourselves, and not against anyone. When will this ever end?
I’m still learning alot about the WN movement, that is my primary reason for coming here. I found the discussion very enlightening, so I think it’s good (for me, and I suspect many other lurkers) that some of these basic questions are discussed here.
At the same time, I think your comment Spooky, is brilliant. It invites us to step back and see a living demonstration of many of the points made in the postings here.
Somehow I wish some of these discussions could take place over on the Forum section, where they could be easier to find. This one could be called “The problem of half-Jews”.
This Edmund Burke fan doesn’t believe in the possibility of a bloodless revolution.
The secessionists promised this in 1860 – we will catch all the blood which is spilled in a thimble, we will wipe it up with a napkin, we volunteer to drink it. What did they deliver? 600,000 dead young White men and a century of Southern poverty.
By the Hunter Wallace/Greg Johnson definition I am not a White Nationalist, since I do not think the partition of the USA into ethnostates is the best strategy for acheiving the well-being of White Americans.
However, I am greatful to Hunter, Greg, RF, Roger Devlin, Kievsky, Matt Parrot and other for taking the time to engage me in debate. It has helped to clarify my thinking.
Crypto you write The way to treat them fairly, which will have the added benefit of making WN more morally attractive to the millions of whites who also have no problem with individual Jews, is to draw a sharp distinction between attacking the agenda of organized Jewry, which is acceptable and necessary, and seeking to limit the future rights of individual citizens who happen to be Jewish, which is not.
Would you extend this same courtesy to all other races? For instance there are many 3rd and 4th generation Japanese Americans. As an ethnic group in America they appear to be almost uniformly intelligent and non-criminal. They, as a group, haven’t seized the commanding heights of our society, like the tribe has, and commenced propaganda aimed at our dismemberment, or trillion dollar looting organizations. Why exclude them from our state?
I’m not quite understanding why you plead for special rules for one group. It’s not like they are the most virtuous minority among us.
I don’t participate in the “ethnostate” talk though I don’t condemn it. I just think things are going to happen as they happen — ethno-tribes will form, and perhaps conglomerate into a White ethnostate just by natural competence.
I don’t foresee large scale race-war, though I do foresee localized skirmishes. Economic war is going to be very important. Mind-War is going to be very important.
Look, all this talk of Aryanism and “white” nationalism is a bit un-American, which is why I have been reluctant to label myself a “white nationalist.” America is a pretty big tent. America historically had loyal Jews and blacks, but these were small minorities and were not over-represented in the leadereship structure. Everyone respected and knew that this was a Christian nation which gave Christians certain privileges and power, but also limited any kind of negative actions against loyal, quiet minorities that were otherwise good citizens. So in the new America that this website and others talk about, it seems to me the key is a restoration of traditional leaders, traditional values, and the traditional respect accorded the historical majority. It certainly would mean the lassoing of international banks and bankers, as well as anti-Christian Hollywood, universities, and educators. But it wouldn’t be a pogrom, more like an affirmative action regime for sensible whites and the same kind of discrimination practiced today against conservative Christian whites practiced against anti-Americans of all backgrounds. But people that live among us who are loyal, or at least not actively disloyal, should not be harmed, discriminated against, or made to feel like shit, particularly if they’re doing all that could reasonably be asked of a minority in any nation-state: no disloyalty, low profile, follow and respect the majority’s laws and customs.
Jackson,
Yes, like Steve Sailer and Pat Buchanan, I would extend the courtesy of equal citizenship rights to Americans of Indigenous American, Asian, Middle Eastern, and African descent that are here already. I’d insist on a strong dominant culture of Occidental norms, and I’d preserve the rights of free private association and limit future non-white immigration, but I have no problem extending equal political rights to minorities willing to live like civilized people, more or less, in a white-majority country. In the event “this horse of mine has already left the barn” and such an order is no longer possible in today’s USA, it could certainly still be constituted in a smaller republic, one made up at least 90+% of people of European descent.
Whites Unite,
I’m with you!
“Honorary Aryan” was a figure of speech. It is just a way of acknowledging there are some people who lack racial purity but are nevertheless valuable individuals in other ways. I want to say South Africa had a system which exempted some individuals from apartheid.
A White ethnostate is a blank slate. It is the raw material we can work with to rebuild a great nation. West Virginia is 95% White, but it is hardly the model of what triumphant WN would look like. Removing obnoxious minorities alone isn’t sufficient to cure the cultural rot that afflicts Whites.
Roach,
“Look, all this talk of Aryanism and ‘white’ nationalism is a bit un-America…America is a pretty big tent. America historically had loyal Jews and blacks, but these were small minorities and were not over-represented in the leadership structure.”
While this is true, maybe we should reject the big tent approach that America has historically taken because, after all, look at the condition of our country today. If we were a little bit more discriminating about the kinds of immigrants that we let into America pre-1924 perhaps the total collapse of our traditional ruling class could have been prevented (if not delayed).
I think that the big tent mindset helped us create a powerful America very quickly (by historical standards) but at the expense of creating long-term problems for our national identity. So the question becomes as follows, since you and I are probably the last generation of Americans, was it all worth it? Was the glory that we enjoyed on the world stage in the 20th century worth the oblivion that we face in the 21st century? I don’t think so.
HW,
“A White ethnostate is a blank slate. It is the raw material we can work with to rebuild a great nation. West Virginia is 95% White, but it is hardly the model of what triumphant WN would look like. Removing obnoxious minorities alone isn’t sufficient to cure the cultural rot that afflicts Whites.”
Very true. A cultural revival (of sorts) is sorely needed.
Hence, Western Racial and Cultural Preservation. The latter is an equally important objective. 🙂
Noticed this little anti-White gem from the Red Princesses’ house-goy Daddy –
65 HW: “…Western…cultural preservation”. Fortunately, we have an extraordinary culture to preserve and build on. Any small town library has more intelligence and virtue within its walls that the entire continents of Africa and South America put together. We are at present perhaps just a remnant, but the power of our culture dwarfs that of our enemies. It is always there, ready to be tapped.
Marcus “Karate Kike” Epstein is a Mossad agent who infiltrated the American Right and subsequently committed his karate-chop cum racial epithet attack on a negress as a part of a Mossad/ZOG psyops campaign to discredit the American Right and White Nationalist allies such as VDare and Pat Buchanan.
Do not trust him.
Take note of commenters like Crypto and “Whites” Unite.
A racially exclusive, Jew free ethno-state, at this point in time, is a pipe dream. It’s a vision. We aren’t even at the point of planning how to achieve it.
Yet Jews like Crypto and shabbos goyim like “Whites” Unite demand we don’t even *imagine* a future separate from Jews. Even our *vision* must make Jews happy, leave room for them, look out for their best interests. And of course, we have to be “intellectually consistent” and have to follow some byzantine notion of “fairness” in how we *imagine* a future separate from Jews. Otherwise, we are Thought Criminals.
And of course, we can’t expect any fairness or consistency from them, far from it, outrageous hypocrisy is the norm.
At this point, we can’t even have a racially exclusive, Jew-free *blog*
I don’t give a damn about Jews or what they think, and even less about “Whites” who do.
@notuswind
In response to: “West Virginia is 95% White, but it is hardly the model of what triumphant WN would look like. Removing obnoxious minorities alone isn’t sufficient to cure the cultural rot that afflicts Whites.”
You wrote:
“Very true. A cultural revival (of sorts) is sorely needed.”
Funny, just was having the same conversation with a friend of mine vis-a-vis our area (Oregon-Washington). We’re not anywhere near the 95% mark, but it’s still perdominantly White here. But it is full of brainwashed self-hating Whites who vote for liberal Jewish and gay politicians, who vote to tax the hell out of everyone and everything, who believe in redistribution to minorities, and a substantial percentage of whom are into drugs or drunkards.
It often occurs to me that the biggest job is saving these people from themselves, but occassionally I do wonder if it’s worth the bother. How is focusing on the microbrew swelling tattoo-and-piercing crowd any different than trying to help negros? In both cases either I, or a group of us, are sacrificing time and energy to uplift people who through either genetics, culture or personal sloth are stuck in bad situations.
There is something to be said for elite culture. (For instance, when you need a nuerosurgeon.)
I’m really not a lot more sympathetic to the white trash pierced & tattooed of Southeast Portland (aka: Felony Flats) , or even the aging hippie types of the Hawthorne with their Obama covered Prius’s, continual voting for “progressives” and all the rest than I am for your basic incompetent section 8 sucking black. None of them are improving my life one whit.
Arguably the Prius crowd are screwing things up the most. (It is possible to completely avoid minorities in Portland. Most people I know do.)
This makes me wonder “why ethnostate”? Why not “virtue-state”? Or “ethic-state”? (Though I’m starting to see the linkages of things from reading here for a few months.)
It’s interesting that there is so much more intensity and interest around the “racial preservation” part of the agenda than “cultural preservation” part. If we did a good enough job on the cultural preservation the racial preservation would take care of itself. It seems the critical part of the job.
What’s the plan?
VVD,
It’s kind of funny how needy they are. It’s a stupid discussion though.
Any sentence that begins with “when we get in power . . .” is BORING and retarded. You shouldn’t even be thinking like that. You should be thinking how to influence the people in your town, maybe your county.
I don’t write these posts to invite stupid debates about who is included and who is excluded in some future fantasy ethnostate. I write with the hopes to inspire readers to bootstrap future-looking businesses such as vegetable garden installation businesses, and build resilient communities.
My incipient tribe practices strong Taqqiyah. Showing hostility to Jews or non-Whites would be incongruous in my area, because there is so much surplus wealth that everyone is “bought off,” as the post about Krugman discusses. But that’ll be changing. Even then, I’m not going to incite ethnic conflict, but rather I’ll emphasis the positive values of White togetherness and solidarity. As far as the JQ, I’ll tell what happened, and say that to avoid that in the future, we have to play the Jews’ game, as good or better than they do, lest we be tyrannized by them.
The way I would wage any kind of “ethnic conflict” against Jews would be economic war or banking war. I read the history of the Rothschilds with endless fascination. They used spying and ethnic networking and corruption of govenrment officials and financial secrecy. Had some Europeans been hip to what the Rothschilds were up to, they could have formed a counter-intelligence service to counter the Rothschild activities and curtail their grand thievery.
MM @69 good point re Epstein. I only hazily remember the details from the newspaper stories, and don’t know anything about Epstein, but wasn’t this incident just in time to help along the anti-Ron Paul Right movement attacks that were going on then?
Upon further research, it seem highly likely that Jules Stern, Katrina’s maternal grandpa, was in fact probably a Jew, and she’s thus a product of Dutch, German perhaps, and German Jewish ancestry (Jews from Germany as I understand having always placed themselves at the top pecking order among Ashkenazis). So the discussion we’ve been having is moot: she’s no Aryan in the Jeffrey Imm mold. Perhaps she’s simply infected with bad genes.
Veni Vidi Dixi,
don’t you feel this sort of debate is useful for clarifying your own ideas? Its certainly useful in that regard for me. After all, you are going to have to persuade a lot of presently unpersuaded white people if your movement is going to grow, no?
Kiev @72, I agree with everything you posted. Offline I am the master of Taqqiyah. My personal preference is to be able to not even talk about Jews or others, but as you can see, we aren’t even allowed to ignore them. They are like the crazy ex-girlfriend who keeps stalking you and just won’t leave you alone. And it moved beyond the keying your car stage a long time ago.
Re Rothschilds, the story of the early British intelligence services is fascinating, John Dee was the original 007.
“they could have formed a counter-intelligence service to counter the Rothschild activities and curtail their grand thievery”
But instead, it seems like everyone invited them into their Mason lodges. Or maybe that was the point from the beginning, who knows. With all the recent talk about the “Fall of the WASP” no one notices that it happened at the same time as the “Fall of the Anglo-American Masons” who were the WASP establishment.
“economic war”
Boycotting the Zionist regime in Palestine is actually illegal in the US. A Paki coworker of mine reacted with true astonishment when he found this out, and exclaimed that what he had heard must really be true, Jews run America.
Jackson,
The racial preservation angle is important because there is no sense in reviving our culture without our people. As HW previously implied, our people (in their current debased state) are only the raw material from which a new cultural foundation can be laid.
Furthermore, the current sociopolitical order must fall away before any kind of cultural revival is possible. I just don’t see how we could revive our culture within the context of today’s sociopolitical environment.
VVD,
Economic war can be done without the enemy being aware of it.
We were unaware of what the Jews were doing all those years. The way we will do things will be the same — the Jews need not even know, except maybe Jewish historians centuries from now.
@Kulaks Never Learn: thanx for info re the CFR van den Heuval; wasn’t sure if this guy was Katrina Sarah’s husband, father, or what. So she is now the whole package: rich, red .5Jew offspring of union between wasp shabbatz-goy and zillionaire daughter of Hollywood MCA Jew$$$$. A genetic, red-globalista. You simply cannot make this stuff up.
@crypto-aryan: I don’t mind your whining at all; you can’t help it. Just stop posting disinformation. As for the place of Jews like yourself when and after TSHTF, we will see which side of the barricades you show up on. Oh, by the way, we are going need people who throw hot lead, not hot air.
Postscript: forgot to mention that Katrina Sarah van den Heuval-Stein lives in the slightly-tribal Hamptons. Her walled estate is a couple of hundred yards away from billionaire globalista Jew George Soros’ equally well-guarded estate. I’m sure they get along fine. Soros-Schwartz’s hedge-fund is HQ’d offshore, pays no taxes, and the Red Princess fought thru the courts, tooth and nail, to avoid taxation on her 30 million dollar trust fund.
Here is an oligarchical heiress with a classic come-punch-me-face.
#39 Donald – “Jews act the way they do because of cultural circumstance. They are a diaspora people who have had to endure centuries of resentment, violence, suspicion, discrimination, and etc… Their entire culture is a reflection of it. I am not sympathizing with them – just pointing out history for you.”
Excuse me, but I believe the Jews have something to do with their “experiences.” They are not innocent. Their “experiences” are the by-product of their actions. Let’s not forget that. Why is the “holocaust” (doesn’t every war end up a holocaust for some group or nation of people?) deemed a Jewish event when an equal number of non-Jews were also killed – and for similar reasons? I am sick and tired of this scapegoated mentality. They whine, whine, whine so much, they have you fooled and a lot of other folks. Take a good look at your country. Are the Jews innocent in its implosion? They might not be alone but they certainly are highly responsible! The Jews did an outstanding job of brainwashing most of mankind. Or suing them into submission…
#40 crypto-aryan “Why can’t you admit you’re an anti-Semite?”
You mean anti-Jewish. I think there are a few out there that don’t have as much of a problem with Arabs as they do with Jews. Probably not too many on this site. I don’t buy the “anti-Semite” tag being used in this case. In fact, in most cases where it’s used. The Jews (not meaning you) even distort the label they apply to their adversaries.
Asking anyone to sterilize or be sterilized is sick.
VDH is a JAP, a Jewish American Princess and like her kinswoman, Susan Sontag, thinks Whites are only good for kindling.
I would be a bit more understanding of our blog-mate Crypto-Aryan. He is a decent guy whom I sincerely believe is just concerned (rightfully or wrongfully) that he, or at least a part of his family, would be either expelled from a potential future White ethnostate, or be made to feel like second-class citizens, or residents.
Just my observation, but I do not think he has antipathy toward us or our values; nor do I think he is trying to tell us what to do or necessarily even how to think.
I work with a few jews who certainly don’t fit into either the JEW image or mindset…with that said, I still cannot trust any of them. But then again, I cannot trust most White people I’ve met either…at least white garbage is OUR garbage!
@ 59 Kievsky
“I don’t foresee large scale race-war”
Been going on for YEARS with only the OTHER side participating.
http://www.whitenationalism.com/ot/ot-06.htm
@ 62 Hunter Wallace
In Raspail’s CAMP OF THE SAINTS there is an Indian character who fits your description.
@85Kulaks Never Learn
“is just concerned (rightfully or wrongfully) that he, or at least a part of his family, would be either expelled from a potential future White ethnostate, or be made to feel like second-class citizens, or residents.”
I have to tell you I’ve seen that same scam on many other forums where alleged partial-Jews or all Jewish or guys married to a Jewess say the VERY SAME THING. It is just too often and with same wording to be coincidence. Just yet another tool in the “DISTORT, DISTRACT, DIVERT” game that the Tribe plays so very well to the disaster of the Whites.
TO ensure clarity:
In Raspail’s CAMP OF THE SAINTS there is an Indian character who fits your description of just such an “HONORARY ARYAN”
“A group of Jewish Democrats wants a large newspaper syndicate to stop publishing conservative commentator Pat Buchanan’s columns.”
http://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/98231-jewish-dems-want-buchanans-column-nixed
VVD — “Yet Jews like Crypto…demand we don’t even *imagine* a future separate from Jews.” Listen, you can imagine whatever you damn well please, and you also don’t have to say “how high?” when i tell you to jump. I offer my opinion, you offer yours. Just like Creators Syndicate has perfect right to have the balls to ignore some Jewish group upset with Pat Buchanan. Personally, I think the most honest rebuttal to what I’m arguing is along the lines of “damn right, Jeffrey Imm can stay in a white ethnostate as long as he’s willing to be a part of it and not spread anti-white rhetoric. Unlike Paul Gottfried and you, he’s ONE OF US. He’s an asshole, but he’s OUR asshole.” That’s the essence of hardcore white nationalism, no? You’re either one of us or you’re not.
Joanne – I agree, “anti-Jewish” is better and more precise than “anti-Semitic.” Sort of like “progressive” is arguably more accurate than “liberal.” Doesn’t have the bite though, and comes off sounding a bit disingenuous. My argument though is that “anti-Semites” ought to coopt the word, like blacks have coopted “nigga” and homosexuals have coopted “queer.”
KNL — thanks for your understanding. i’m sure my motivation IS partially personal, as is my sympathy for pro-white politics in general. i’m basically a liberal who grew up in a nearly all-white area, then in my adult life found myself in minority-dominated educational, employment and neighborhood situations. i kept my mind and eyes open throughout and retained my curiosity for heterodox, transgressive thinking. that’s why i’m here.
at the same time, i DO think that there is strong practical and moral justification for not treating individuals belonging to ANY group under the law as if their behavior automatically comports with mean group characteristics. There are all kinds of variations. I can’t think of any good reasons for instance for not allowing blacks who can get admitted without affirmative action to be a part of an elite institution. I also agree with Roach when he says this has always been a diverse country. Unless you can show me that its always a slippery slope to where we don’t want to go, I think small, managable amounts of diversity are tolerable, or even a net positive, in a healthy society. I recall Jared Taylor even saying once that “a healthy society doesn’t need anti-miscegenation laws.” I’d agree, and I don’t have a problem with miscegenation either, as long as its rare.
I also agree with Roach when he says this has always been a diverse country. Unless you can show me that its always a slippery slope to where we don’t want to go, I think small, managable amounts of diversity are tolerable, or even a net positive, in a healthy society. I recall Jared Taylor even saying once that “a healthy society doesn’t need anti-miscegenation laws.” I’d agree, and I don’t have a problem with miscegenation either, as long as its rare.
Read this article by Richard McCulloch on why separation is necessary for racial preservation.
“Separation: The Preservationist Imperative”
http://racialcompact.com/preservationimperative.html
I recall Jared Taylor even saying once that “a healthy society doesn’t need anti-miscegenation laws.” I’d agree, and I don’t have a problem with miscegenation either, as long as its rare.
That’s the point, no population is 100% healthy, there is a minority of sociopathic, psychopathic, and mentally ill people. We have laws to protect us from that minority of troublemakers and deviants, to uphold the common good. Miscegenation is a crime against nature and the people, it should always be banned and punished. If you enjoy miscegenation move to Latin America.
Doesn’t this whole idea of being an “honorary Aryan” and the like bring us right back to where we are today, that we should just value people’s behavior, that we’re a proposition nation? Well if they will just act like us then they can live with us and we can all get along. Kumbaya my Lord, Kumbaya…