Open Thread — Adolf Hitler

Hitler in 1933One way or another, the man born on this date will never be forgotten.  Worshiped or reviled, studied and feared to this day, he created and led an ideology that the entire power structure of the Western World is dedicated to suppressing.  The current intellectual climate prevents a nuanced view — you either love him or hate him.  Many white nationalists look to him in the same way teenagers with no musical taste look to a pop star — he is the most convenient symbol of white resistance and so by default, you support him.  There’s nothing substantial there.  However, many others who have studied the Reich and its Leader, with all of its faults and shortcomings, still consider him one of the greatest leaders any nation has ever had.

There is obviously a dissenting view.  Some variants of this are as follows —

  • Hitler was not a white nationalist.  He waged unremitting war on millions of fellow whites and slaughtered them ruthlessly.
  • He was a capitalist reactionary (or a conservative).  He cynically used National Socialism to win the support of workers, then purged the true believers in order to align with the old fashioned German imperialists and big business.
  • National Socialism, while pro-white (or at least pro-German) was still tyrannical and should be opposed.
  • Hitler launched a war that more than anything else destroyed the Western world, killed millions of whites, and handed over our civilization to a parasitic elite that continues to oppress us today.

Where do you stand?  Do you consider Hitler to be your Fuhrer?  Or do you consider him to be a painful embarrassment or even responsible for our current situation?  Debate below.

And just to be fair, here is my view…

Hitler was a politician.  Being a politician means making compromises and performing the art of the possible.  This idea that he developed some creed which he then campaigned on relentlessly and convinced the German people with is false.   He didn’t just walk up to a podium and start screaming about Jews.  He built coalitions, supported some constituencies, and turned on others depending on political circumstances.  He built a movement from the ground up in one of the greatest accomplishments of modern history and in the face of incredible opposition, something we often forget today.

It is so very easy to write a book or an internet essay saying how a racial state should be governed, or what “correct” politics should consist of.  Actually practicing real world politics is a necessary skill that all too many of our laptop philosophers ignore.  In that respect, I think the Fuhrer, by combining diverse constituencies and opposing philosophies into a National Socialist state that has much to admire is an example that we should look to.  This doesn’t mean putting on swastikas and marching around — it means studying how he operated in the political environment of his time to do what he thought best for the volk.  Also, as I mentioned before on this site, it is impossible, simply impossible, to dismiss the seductive aura of the Reich that he built.

What he did wrong was his single minded focus on an old fashioned German expansionist foreign policy.  This was the primary goal of his life, even more than racial rebirth.  He showed a lack of imagination and vision in his approach to other European states.  Rather than unifying the white race, he did much to plunge us into a pointless fratricidal conflict.  He does not bear sole or even primary responsibility for this — Winston Churchill gets a large share of the blame as well, as do others.  However, to pretend that Hitler did not want war or that he was “forced” into it somehow ignores history.

Adolf Hitler failed and that failure carried a terrible cost for our people.  Nonetheless, unlike the vast majority of the rest of the world, I will not revile the man’s memory.   Indeed, I will remember him with great respect.  I hope some day we can build a world that is capable of a more nuanced view and can give him the credit for his accomplishments that he deserves as well as recognition of his failures.  So Adolf Hitler — some misgivings notwithstanding — Sieg Heil!

Last I’ll say on it.  Go to town on the comments below but please, keep it civil, no name calling, and no bad faith arguments.  Let’s debate today, but unite and get back to work for our common future tomorrow.

  • Charles U. Farley412

    JWN, you are attacking, you are attacking National Socialists and anti-semites who are proud member of this blog and are working to save Aryan-kind from the culture of critique launched by your co-ethnics.

    As for your appearance, I highly doubt you look Nordic. I know that this greatly disturbs Jews, but you all have a distinct Jewish look that one can look for: http://www.enwhiten.com/?page_id=1774

    We have identified your kind in the past and dealt with your crimes… and shall do so again!

  • JewishWhiteNationalist

    Farley. When did I say I look Nordic? Not all White people are Nordic, you do realize that, right? Or are you one of those who writes off Southern Europeans and Eastern Europeans as “not White”, just as you do with Jews?

    Not once in my entire life has anyone ever thought I was Jewish. Even other Jews could never tell. I always have to tell them I am Jewish. It used to be a major source of annoyance to me, until I realized it was actually an unintended compliment (lol). They always think I am Italian (which is true, because half of me is Italian.)

  • JewishWhiteNationalist

    Hey Farley, I just clicked on your link. Very amusing! By those standards, you would never recognize me as a Jew.
    I don’t have a Jewish surname. My husband is a Northern European Aryan, and I have his name.
    My first name? Christine. You lose again.
    My occupation? Homemaker. Again: fail.
    Appearance? Do you know what Alessandra Mussolini looks like? Imagine her, but about 5 years older. That’s me!

  • Kulaks Never Learn

    Well, one good thing has happened out of my time here: in reading some of the blog, I’ve discovered the blog of another Jewish WN! I know a few in my personal life, but didn’t know there were any others producing a blog. Now I do, so I have this blog to thank for that! – JewishWhiteNationalist

    JWN – If you are referring to ‘Jew Among You’ (J.A.Y.) — he is one of mine as well.

  • Veni Vidi Dixi

    “The sooner people like that are gone from the movement, the sooner the masses of White people will sit up and listen to the message.”

    And that is the actual agenda of course, haven’t we all seen this a dozen times now? As if White people are just waiting to be White Nationalists just as soon as we purge the nasty anti-semites.

    “We support the creation of a Jew-free, racially exclusive White ethnostate in North America.”

  • JewishWhiteNationalist

    VVD: There’s no “agenda”, not on my part at least. I’m just telling you that as long as any of you glorify Hitler and engage in antisemitism that is irrational (there is rational antisemitism, and I recognize that), WNism will always be on the fringes of society and not taken seriously by the masses of Whites. You can take that for what its worth, or not. If you have any serious hopes of succeeding as a movement, idolizing Hitler, and engaging in almost comical forms of antisemitism is not the way to do it.

    This is why I respect people like David Duke. I might not agree with him on everything, but I have read both his books (My Awakening and Jewish Supremacy), and he at least comes across as rational and not a Hitler worshipper (yes, I know he was in his youth).

    As an example, why do you think Stormfront bans the use of swastikas in their avatars?

  • AnalogMan

    #67 Greg Johnson – “The truth is that the maniacal Hitler of popular demonology is a World War II propaganda fiction, and the principal purpose of the fiction’s incessant repetition more than fifty years after the war is to stigmatize any nationalist movement, NS or otherwise.”

    Excellent point, and so blindingly, obviously true. Of course the Allies used propaganda. Are we to believe “…but our propaganda was all true!”? So, where is this propaganda? Is it just in the old Walt Disney cartoons? No, it’s in the history books, and now it is all true – by government edict.

    What is the truth? I have no way of knowing. But here’s an interesting perspective you haven’t included in your list. “My” barber, a German born during WWII, is convinced that Hitler was a tool of the Illuminati conspiracy. The goal of the conspiracy, he says is world government. Phase one started with the French Revolution and culminated with WWI; its purpose was to destroy the royal houses of Europe. Phase two was Hitler; his purpose was to discredit nationalism, to make people receptive to world government. You can’t deny that that’s at least consistent with the facts – and with the above quotation. That’s precisely where we are now.

    According to his theory, Hitler never intended to win the war. He speaks of Germany having jet fighters as early as 1941, but Hitler vetoing production. Hitler, a part of the Jewish globalist conspiracy? Who’lda thunk it?

  • “Message to Putin: If you’d like to invade Western Europe, please do !”

    I second this motion.

  • Really, there’s just very little chance that the pansified British, German, or French armies would be able to win a decisive victory over Muslims, even if their Governments let them fight the Muslims at all.

    In contrast I have full confidence that the Russian Army could clear Western Europe of Non-Whites in a matter of weeks.

  • Carnegie

    Let’s not let the Jew hijack this thread. Please ban JewishWhiteNationalist. If he/she really were a White Nationalist it wouldn’t have prefixed its moniker with “Jewish”. JWN is already behaving like a typical Jewish drama queen, all of its half dozen posts have been about its own sense of persecution and tips for White Nationalists which ultimately benefit Jews.

    This thread is about Hitler. Lets keep on task.

  • JewishWhiteNationalist

    Carnegie, But, you see, if I did not add “Jewish” to my moniker, and it came out later on in discussion, I would be then accused of being “deceptive” and trying to conceal what I am. Right?

    To me, being Jewish is like the fact that I am also of Italian heritage; its one of my ethnicities. Would you have had a similar problem if I called myself ItalianWhiteNationalist? Because I can just as easily do that, and have elsewhere. How about DanishWhiteNationalist? Sometimes people like to clarify what ethnicity they belong to in addition to being WN.

    But its OK, I’ll bow out.

  • Denise

    Jews started WWII. They used the suicidal internecine WWI, to seize Palestine from the actual Semites, living there. Ever heard of the Balfour Declaration? Any-one?

    Jews fomented WWII, in order to drive wealthy, educated bloated German Jew parasites, out of beautiful, civilized, cultivated Germany, into scrubby, empty, little Palestine. German Jews weren’t interested. They had it too good in Germany. The Rothschilds and the Krupps funded Hitler, in order to frighten them out. It’s didn’t really work, and Hitler slipped the leash.

    Paul Warburg (what else did this Jew do?) ran the Versailles Convention, and the evil and punative measures, of the Treaty of same created the horrendous economic conditions, which set the stage for Hitler’s rise to power.

    Why are all of you, who condemn him, forgetting all this?

    The British were well under the control of Jewry by the 20th Century. London is their European HQ. The vile traitor George V did whatever his Talmudic Masters told him to do, including abandon his own blood to the blood-thirsty Bolshevik-is-Another-Name-for-Jew monsters. Any-one remember the murdered Romanovs? Those stunningly beautiful White Princesses, gunned down, then gutted? What about the luminous young Prince, who would have led his Nation to a better world, had he not been slaughtered like an animal, as a teenager, by the Psychotic Satan Worshipping Jews?

    STOP blaming Adolf Hitler for trying to defend his Nation! He made mistakes. He was fighting overwhelming odds. But he tried He’s the very last White Leadar that tried to protect his Volk. The USA and England has already fallen to Talmudic Tyranny. We are now living under the results of their machinations – not Hitler’s.

    Adolf Hitelr was a Tragic Hero. Shame on those of you that fall prey to the Jew trap, of blaming him for what happened to Whites, in the 20th century. Blaming Hitler, and going along with the Judaic demonization, and allowing their lies to stand only serves their goals. Jews are still setting the terms of debate. Don’t you see this? The harsh White Light of Truth must be turned back on THEM.

    Are you White Nationalists?

    Then the truth MUST be told. It’s not “Hitler-worship” (their characterization, to keep you in their box) – it’s TRUTH.

  • Robert Campbell

    JewishWhiteNationalist, you’re out of here, you subversive Jewess.

    Do not come back.

  • Kulaks Never Learn

    Let’s never forget, as well, that so much of what passes for ‘historical truth’ coming out of twentieth-century German history is often UTTER LIES.

    Since WW2 cannot be seen and understood properly without understanding WW1, it is crucial to remember that both conflicts are essentially one war — with a twenty year respite in between.

    Germany was, truly, the victim of that pointless and stupid conflict (originally called the ‘Great War’) that was foisted upon her, by a tragic and genocidal alliance system cooked up by the British Foreign Office — all in the intention of crushing the rising economic power of the newly-unified Deutsches Reich (Second German Reich of von Bismarck).

    Even though the German armies may have struck first in the summer of 1914, what were they suppose to do??? Sit there waiting for the ‘Allies’ to invade them first? The Czar of Russia already mobilized his army, gaining a tremendous advantage — which certainly showed in the significant gains made in the Russian invasion of East Prussia (before they were crushed in the Battle of Tannenburg by Generals’ Hindenberg and Ludendorff).

    Germany invaded Belgium and France to knock out the threat on its Western Front so as it could better be able to deal with the massive numbers on its Eastern Front. This was the basis for its Schlieffen Plan, which the Germans largely knew that Great Britain — through its contrived continental alliance systems — wanted to crush Germany as a competitor and a rival.

    And then, for the ‘crime’ of fighting well on the battlefield — Germany gets saddled with the truly criminal Versailles Treaty, losing a good deal of her territory (such as its eastern borders – which was the embryonic start to the German-Polish border dispute that was the symbolic beginning of the Second War, an unfortunate problem which Hitler was attempting to correct and mitigate with Poland since he took office in 1933). Chancellor Hitler even offered an alliance with the Poles, and ceding to them a good deal of historic German territory in this regard, to avoid any problems that could arise from this.

    Tragically, much of the Polish resistence to German requests for a true diplomatic solution to the border problem cam from, of course, England and the British Foreign Office, just like it did during the First World War.

    So much for British ‘fairness’, ‘sportsmanship’, and, particularly, economic ‘free trade’!

    Germany – the greatest tragic hero of the twentieth century.

  • Denise

    Robbie – I just read your treatise on Hitler. That thread seems ot be closed. You have written so beautifully, and movingly, I have tears in my eyes now.

    Thank you, Robert. Thank you. You are truly a Deep Soul.

  • Denise

    England is paying a terrible price for the evil England has wrought. To the Boers, and to their racial cousins, the Germans.

    They deserve what they are getting. I am sorry to say this – but it’s true.

  • JWN

    Robert Campbell,

    Mr Wallace says in many places on this blog that he has no problem with Jews who do not toe the typical Jewish party line. I would be one of those Jews. I have been very behaved since being here, and not insulting anyone or namecalling at all. Actually, some have called me “maggot”, vermin, etc with no warrant for it.

    So why am I told to leave? Please don’t prove that you guys really do hate each and every Jew no matter what. Unless that is the truth?

  • Veni Vidi Dixi

    Excluding from a blog = “hate”

    Just simply trying to ignore them = “holocaust”

  • Robert Campbell

    @167

    Since you have been here, which is not long at all, you have done nothing but assert your Jewish ethnic identity and lobby for the interests of such. You have done this in an obnoxious, boorish, and repetitive manner (I have deleted several of your posts on these grounds), while using the deliberately inflammatory, and oxymoronic, user name of “JewishWhiteNationalist.”

    You seem to apply the Auster WN litmus test: your primary concern is whether or not a certain person, party or platform benefits the Jews. That is your primary agenda, and it is at odds with our mission of creating a Jew-free White ethnostate in North America.

    There are many blogs that cater to your philosemitic agenda, but this is not one of them, and I will not have it subverted on my watch. While we do have a mischling or two posting here, they generally comport themselves in a civil manner and proclaim positions congruent with our stated objectives (Fred Scrooby pops to mind in this respect), whereas you sow discord and seek to advance Jewish tribal identity at the expense of ethnic solidarity among Whites.

    Generally speaking, our entire discursive space (posts and comments) should be Judenfrei. This is a medium for us, and whatever else you, as Jews, might be, you are undeniably not us.

    If you continue to use a proxy anonymiser to rotate your IP address, and re-post comments after they have been deleted and an Administrator has duly informed you that you are no longer welcome here, this speaks volumes to your character and your intentions.

  • Well, I’m here. CREEPS.
    All of you are the biggest morons in the PLANET.
    All of you dummy Jew haters, attack Zion and then have the AUDACITY to tell people you ‘love’ Jesus–LOL. Ha…….ha…ha.
    The New Testament says that “Jesus IS the Cornerstone of Zion”
    So much for your FAKERY.
    First of all schmucks; There are NO “Zionists” in this current administration, thats #1.
    #2. They have a name and IF you would point it out, you might be given the courtesy of being on the ADL hate list. But you DONT.
    They are BOLSHEVIKS, all of them, white gentile MORONS among the soul assassins.
    #3. Keep pushing that Islmo-lovin propaganda and call yourselves “White Nationalists” What a JOKE!
    You preach ISLAMIC propaganda.
    Seig Heil FAGGOTS!

  • MGLS

    England is paying a terrible price for the evil England has wrought. … They deserve what they are getting.

    This is an absolutely appalling thing to say.

  • Alfred Rosenberg

    Atta girl, Denise!
    ‘Cept maybe the funding business.

    And a good point by Ted, way back. I’d sure as hell have preferred to be governed by Hitler than FDR, Churchill or Stalin, none of whom had an original thought in their whole lives. Compare Hitler’s writing to the ghost-written tripe sloshed around by “the big three”.

  • 1.) You’re barking up the wrong tree. I’m not a Christian.

    2.) I don’t give a damn about Israel. My position is that Organized Jewry should not be allowed to manipulate our foreign policy. Israel should be cut loose and left to its own devices.

    3.) I don’t advocate the destruction of Israel.

    4.) The Obama administration has continued the pro-Israel policies of its predecessors.

    5.) I’m not interested in Muslims. They are another minority that should be deported and/or excluded from North America.

  • Denise

    OH NO!!!! The Mad Jewess! She is on the Political Cesspool blog, as well.

    She is an admitted member of the JDIF. Go to Incogman’s blog, for the full story. There are also hilarious videos, of the Mad Jewess, “singing” on his blog.

  • Charlemagne

    Not for nothing, but doesn’t it seem as if ‘the Mad Jewess’ and ‘Denise’ have incredibly similar writing styles??

  • Denise

    Charlemange – you must be thinking of yourself, and MLFDS.

  • Robert Campbell

    We have been infested by Jews today.

    I have done my best to remedy the situation; alas, I lack the potency of Die Deutsche Gesellschaft für Schädlingsbekämpfung.

    Ladies and gentlemen, please support your local Einsatz-Kommando. 😉

  • Junghans

    The invasion of the mind snatchers. They are attracted to Hitler like sharks to blood. They have gotten tremendous mileage out of beating up on a dead White man and the “nawtzees” for 65 years now. Its ‘Tikkun Olam’, don’t you see, don’t you know!

  • I would like to thank OD and in particular Greg Johnson and Andrew for their civil and very elucidative exchange. I liked it so much that I have included a selection of the debate in the latest entry of my blog.

    IMHO, Johnson was right in his reply to Andrew when he said that the system that the founders helped to create was inherently flawed (hence the rise of the Jews).

  • john thames

    My view of Hitler was that of Winston Churchill: “I admire the patriotic achievment while disliking the system.” One misconception about National Socialism should be corrected. It was, indeed, a very heavily socialist operation. Structurally, it was similar to Roosevelt’s New Deal in its reliance upon deficit financing and public works projects. As to Hitler’s expansionist foreign policy, he bit off more than he could chew. Still, the attack on Soviet Russia was a strategic necessity because of Stalin’s own attack plans.

    Hitler’s anti-Jewish policies also failed although it is difficult to see how they could have succeeded. Der Fuehrer’s views on Jews were fairly typical of his times. Lots of Americans shared the view that Jews were behind Communism. A very good source on this is Joseph Bendersky’s book, “The ewish Threat: Anti-Semitic Politics of the U.S. army”.

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  • Proud White Man

    Obviously the “evikl” of Hitler and the Nazis was exaggerated by the Allies during (and after) the war. We still do that today. The thing that was different was the Jewish people using the plight of the Jews during the war to elicit pity for generations afterward. This pity has translated into “support Israel or you are an anti-Semite Nazi”. That is what I cannot stand. I believe Israel is almost an enemy of the USA – see the Lavon affair, USS Liberty, Jonathan Pollard, etc. – yet we give them billions and allow their agents to bribe… excuse me, give campaign donations to our Congress and Executives. Crazy, utterly crazy. Time for Israel to sink or swim on her own. We should be entirely neutral with regard to Israel and her “enemies”. Sell both sides weapons for cash, trade with both, but do not choose sides. If Israel is worthy, she will survive. If not, then she will be replaced. Either way it doesn’t affect me, and I do not want my tax dollars going to a nation that attacks our sailors and spies on us.

  • Suppressing the truth about Hitler and National Socialism is not pro-White, it is pro-Jew

    Hitler and National Socialism. Even in “pro=White” circles Hitler and National Socialism are very divisive topics. The vast majority of White people in the United States have been taught that Hitler was a genocidal madman and National Socialism was simply a way to carry out his maniacal plans. That is what I was taught anyway and that is what I used to believe. Every major form of media and avenue of information that people have access to portrays Hitler as being no better than Satan himself. Thankfully, the internet exists and people can have access to information that is not the Jewish dominated television stations, or the Jewish dominated entertainment industry, or the Jewish dominated newspaper industry, or the Jewish dominated school textbook producers, or the Jewish, Marxist academic institutions whose goal it is to churn out self- loathing White sheeple.

    I can’t really blame White people for believing so much in the Jewish lies and propaganda that they have been exposed to for their entire lives. To even utter a positive word about National Socialism or Hitler is one of the biggest sins a White person can commit these days. The reactions of people after they have found out that you have read books about race are priceless but nothing compares to the reactions of people when they find out that you are reading or have read Mein Kampf. I have had people tell me that I am hateful and intolerant because I was reading Mein Kampf at the time. Of course, these self-proclaimed “tolerant” people have never read a single word of Mein Kampf themselves.

    Once I educated myself I fully realized why the truth has been suppressed about Hitler and National Socialism. Jewry is a cancer that destroys White nations and National Socialism is the scalpel that can cut it out and make them healthy again. Parasites can’t survive under National Socialism. Hitler actually agonized over the subject of Jewry. It took some time for him to develop his views on Jews but after seeing things with his own eyes and witnessing the consequences of having the alien race take hold in every facet of society, ‘reason’ defeated ‘feeling’. Unfortunately most people have developed their worldviews on feeling instead of reason. They would rather watch feel good movies and tv shows in which racial diversity and multiculturalism is portrayed as something that is noble and healthy for White people. People feel more comfortable watching movies and T.V shows that depict Jews as nothing but noble and trustworthy victims of the ‘Holohoax’. People have become severely detached from reality because it is much more comfortable and safe to go along with what they have been taught since birth. Venturing into the unknown and seeking the truth scares them to death because all they have ever known is the comfortable, Jew created house of cards in which they live.

    I remind myself often that White people have been totally subverted by the Jew. The level of evil of the Jew is so ridiculously deep that when someone has the willingness to speak of the Jewish issue in its entirety it seems far-fetched to the average White person who only knows what they have been taught their entire lives. This is why censoring and especially the bashing of Hitler by supposedly educated Nationalists is such a travesty. By doing so they are censoring truth and that is not pro-White, it’s pro Jew. It is one thing if someone ignorantly speaks of Hitler and National Socialism because they are simply uneducated. It is something entirely different when someone knows the truth about Hitler and National Socialism and chooses to deceive others solely because of their own cowardice. In my opinion it is impossible to consider yourself anything other than a traitor if after reading the words of Hitler in Mein Kampf, you still speak ill of him by insulting him and National Socialism. He was the complete opposite of a madman. He was completely in touch with reason and reality. He simply had the willingness to act on it.

  • Outlier

    Neat story ….

    ” German U-boat may be at bottom of Labrador river ” Labrador is Northern Canada on Atlantic-side.

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/newfoundland-labrador/story/2012/07/25/nl-u-boat-labrador-discovery-725.html

  • Allan ritchie

    To my mind Hitler was a traitor clevourly disguised as some sought of ultra patriot or nationalist and therein explains his sucess but he only scraped in by the seat of his trousers recognizing fact he was rapidly being seen through by people